[rdfweb-dev] hey

David HM Spector spector at zeitgeist.com
Mon Jun 30 20:17:25 UTC 2003 

Hi Marc,

This is exactly the kind of issue I was raising on the rdfweb-dev list   =

several weeks ago with my questions about the hierarchy of FoaF markup  =

and the need for the ability to embed/encapsulate markup inside other  =

markup to explicitly show now just that you know someone or some thing  =

but how/why you know someone/something.

Without the ability to explicitly specify the context(s) of FoaF markup  =

(all FoaF assertions are at the "top level"),  FoaF's viability seem to  =

me to be quite limited.

David

On Monday, June 30, 2003, at 12:37 PM, Marc Canter wrote:

> What Urs brings up is ONE real benefit of deploying FOAF into the real  =

> world.=A0This is a pragmatic implementation =96 which requires FOAF to  =

> represent more than one level of relationship.
>
> =A0
>
> Look at it this way:
>
> =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0- as these social networking system spre=
ad (Friendster is  =

> adding 12k people A DAY)
>
> =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0- the need arises to transfer or connect=
 the various  =

> friends links or reputations systems that develop
>
> =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0- yes =96 indeed they=92re called =91tru=
sted networks=92
>
> =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0- some of these social software vendors =
consider these  =

> trusted nets =96 THEIR I.P.
>
> =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0- while others have said they=92re willi=
ng to open them up  =

> =96and connect them to others
>
> =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0- I=92ve done a survey of existing and p=
lanned trust systems  =

> (Affero, XpertWeb, NetDeva)
>
> =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0- and none of them are using FOAF as a =
=91data structure=92 for  =

> representing one=92s personal set of friends links
>
> =A0
>
> SO now you have a goal!
>
> =A0
>
> As TypePad comes out and sets in stone the usage of FOAF as a blogroll  =

> representation system
>
> =A0
>
> It=92s up to you guys =96 and me =96 and a few others=85=85
>
> =A0
>
> To get FOAF used elsewhere =96 and THEN if we can connect SixApart=92s  =

> efforts to:
>
> =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0- inter-connecting trust systems, blogro=
lls and friends  =

> networks=85.from all over the Net
>
> =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0- tying in one=92s personal meta-data
>
> =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0- bring in GPS, RSS and other existing s=
tandards into the  =

> mix
>
> =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0- tying this into all the research, OWL,=
 W3C, T B-L efforts  =

> and ideas=85=85=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=
=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0
>
> =A0
>
> You can be DAMM CLOSE to having some real semantical value out there.
>
> =A0
>
> Thanks Ben =96 for getting this started.=A0And thank you Morten for the  =

> cool, new FOAF Explorer features.
>
> =A0
>
> Now it=92s time to get this stuff into the hands =96 of the people!
>
> =A0
>
> - Marc Canter
>
> =A0
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Urs Gehrig [mailto:urs at circle.ch]
> Sent:Monday, June 30, 20036:05 AM
> To: 'Marc Canter'
> Subject: RE: [rdfweb-dev] hey
>
> =A0
>
> dear marc
>
> =A0
>
> what do you thing about my idea?
>
> http://www.circle.ch/blog/p912.html
>
> =A0
>
> regards, urs
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: rdfweb-dev-bounces at vapours.rdfweb.org  =

> [mailto:rdfweb-dev-bounces at vapours.rdfweb.org] On Behalf OfMarc Canter
> Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2003 7:46 PM
> To: foaf-contact at rdfweb.org; danbri at w3.org;  =

> rdfweb-dev at vapours.rdfweb.org
> Cc: Shelley Powers; Ben Hammersley; Morten Frederiksen
> Subject: [rdfweb-dev] hey
>
> I just read over this:
>
> =A0
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/rdfweb-dev/message/102
>
> =A0
>
> =85=85which talks about photos and six degrees of connection.=A0Have you  =

> checked out Fotolog.net?=A0I like the co-depiction photos thingie.=A0I  =

> noticed that the dim sum shots were taken behind the Hotel  =

> Krasnopolski inAmsterdam. I don=92t have to tell you that my favorite  =

> =91coffee shop=92 is right there=85=85
>
> =A0
>
> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
>
> =A0
>
> I also wanted to reach out to you about FOAF in general.=A0I had a great  =

> time with Morten Fredericksen inCopenhagenlast weekend and he said you  =

> two are REALLY the FOAF folks to talk to.
>
> =A0
>
> 1.I pleaded with him to have you set up a FOAF.org. I know, I know =96  =

> that you THINK that rdfweb.org is the same as foaf.org but in fact  =

> it=92s not.
>
> =A0
>
> 2.I=92d make you or Aaron Schwartz my friends =96 but I have to go grok  =

> the difference between the approach Morten showed me and the =91other=92  =

> one.
>
> =A0
>
> 3.Which brings me to MY purpose for being here =96 which is actually two  =

> fold:
>
> =A0
>
> =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0- think of me as a marketing gu=
y.=A0
>
> =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=
=A0=A0- I take/look at technology and make it  =

> plausible for humans.=A0So case in point =96 I tell someone asks about  =

> FOAF. They type in FOAF.org and get nothing.=A0They then think =93who are=
  =

> these FOAF people, why don=92t they have FOAF.org?=94
>
> =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=
=A0=A0- I=92m sure you=92re bombarded daily (in your  =

> role as a W3C nerd) to make this semantic web stuff =96 more human  =

> friendly.
>
> =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=
=A0=A0- I can help and FOAF is at a juncture (as  =

> it=92s about to be supported by TypePad) =96 so NOW is the time to take  =

> this to the next stage=85..
>
> =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=
=A0=A0- So hanging around the mail list, speaking  =

> up, pointing out key factors =96 will be my role=85.
>
> =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0- I=92m an entrepreneur =96 a t=
oolsmith =96 and we=92re working  =

> on software that has many social implications.=A0A new kind of tool.=A0A  =

> new paradigm of tools.
>
> =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=
=A0=A0- I got a chance to show Morten what we=92re  =

> up to
>
> =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=
=A0=A0- Hopefully we=92ll be able to leverage and  =

> include FOAF in our plans
>
> =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=
=A0=A0- I=92ve been helping get something called  =

> ThreadsML going=85. (ask Danny Ayers about that=85.)
>
> =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=
=A0=A0- We=92re also working on an =91OpenIdentity=92  =

> effort (more later)
>
> =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0- So I=92m here and ready to ro=
ck=85..
>
> =A0
>
> 4.Not sure if this letter gets me onto the mail list. Another case in  =

> point.=A0The way OTHER people do it =96 they have a statement which > say=
s=85..
>
> =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=93Here=92s our mail list=94 =
=96 =93Here=92s what you have to do to  =

> sign for the mail list.=94
>
> =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0It=92s little things like that =
that humans like=85=85.
>
> =A0
>
> 5.Anway =96 don=92t wanna start off this relationship on the negative  =

> side. This is exciting shit!=A0I=92m jazzed.=A0Being a former best friend=
 of  =

> Dave Winer =96 and being someone who helped change the world =96 already =
=96  =

> puts me into a unique position to help you and to help me and to hold  =

> hands and sing: =93Kum bah yah=94
>
> =A0
>
> J
>
> _______________________________________________
> rdfweb-dev mailing list
> rdfweb-dev at vapours.rdfweb.org
> wiki: http://rdfweb.org/topic/FoafProject
> http://rdfweb.org/mailman/listinfo/rdfweb-dev
>
------------------------------------------------------------------------ =

------------------
David HM Spector	 	                            spector (at  =

)zeitgeist.com
architecture/design/planning - security consultation - due diligence
Office:(631)261-5013                                            Cell:  =

(631)827-3132
Website: www.zeitgeist.com          Blog: zeitblog.zeitgeist.com:8668
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